Opinion, Religion, Reality.

True words!!! 👍😘

@minxyMolly Thank's for the repost! 😘

So sad to think you feel that way brother. All I can say is I once felt the sa

@Weirdwolf do sad to think you feel that way brother,

@Weirdwolf all I can say us I once felt the same way. When life catches up with you and you search for a meaning, a purpose, eventually you come to terms that all is not what it seems.

@merlin1038 no offence intended to those who don't share my opinion my friend, just my opinion based on the life I've lived, the research I've done and the 37 years spent in the lack of divinity. I pray to the old gods, those before the concept of Christianity, and listen, and they answer, and they give me reason to believe where all I have seen from modern faiths is deception, and death.

@Weirdwolf I pray your heart will be stilled and the scales will fall from your eyes brother.

I kinda get what youre saying.. Except for the Satans crown bit.. Poetic licence maybe? But you can't have an Antichrist without a christ

@merlin1038 I understand, it is your way, and I respect that. And I am your friend, regardless of God's, regardless of faith and based on the fact that gods aside, you and I are men, and will always be, regardless of gods and monsters 😉

Am I missing out on something cos I don't pray at all?? Anywho, a great piece fella 👍

@Burrfoot to net serve one, must we not serve the other in the absence of a greater choice? I choose the word'Satan in the literary sense, the word meaning adversary. I am an adversary of that which I deny

@Weirdwolf all I can say brother is that it took me 40 years to see.🙏

It's too late for my befuddled brain, so by satan it's poetic license, literal word as opposed to horned beast with fiery breath?

@Burrfoot not through hatred or evil or an aura of darkness, but through that which I have seen, that which I have heard and that which I have found. I was a born again Christian once, I was a pagan, I was a duelist and I was lost. Here I finds self with an opinion that goes back further than the accepted religions, to a time when religion had purity and was not splintered into weakness. Again though, it's my opinion, and not written to offend.

You can serve either one but I don't think you can deny one while believing in t'other?

@smellyfingers thanks my friend. The diversity of belief is vast, and as branches we all grow from the same tree.

@Burrfoot I don't believe in either, I think their both literary interpretations, concepts on which to base morality. I believe in something, but what I believe in does not involve devils and angels, they come across to me as thought forms born of human definition which change with human interpretation in order to control. The old pagan gods, long before god and Satan are built in spiritual fact, as well as archaeological proof. This is seen in ancient

Civilisations that predate any current ideology. Look at the world today and tell me that the accepted religions of the world have not failed.

That's what I thought and I agree to a large degree as posted in last nights discussion.. As long as man has walked the earth he has created deities.. Cavemen ones are no more or less appealing than modern ones

@Burrfoot @Weirdwolf I have always been told/taught from an early age that I can be and do whatever I chose too, therefore IMO faith comes from within, I believe in me and don't need nor want someone or something to tell me how I should live or die. Each to their own tho and obviously some lose their path in life and may/may not need a nudge in the right direction, some nudge for their own gains others may not. At the end of the day whatever makes you happy as IMO we all heading for the same destination, what happens when we get there is anyone's guess really. 👍

@Burrfoot I think the modern ones are far more vicious due to the 'human' means at their disposal. Look at Israel and its power, even the great united states of America is subject to their whim. How many people have died in the middle east in the last few years? Innocent blood on a was God's hands. Just the way I see it my friend.

@smellyfingers you can net that peado bastard child killer who killed young Tia called himself a christian, same with the batman killer, and that Swedish Templar Nutcase. Says it all really. Have you seen the movie 'Jesus Camp'? Or 'Zeitgeist'? Worth a watch, real eye openers. My opinion is not born if ignorance.

@Weirdwolf you write very convincingly brother and I cannot deny a lot of what you do but we all see this world with different eyes.

@Weirdwolf don't agree but I do the the flow of this piece. Just a few questions though if I may.. What made you choose christianity and what made you leave it? What was your research and you say that Tia's killer and the rest were 'Christians' does that mean you think all Christians are like that?

@Weirdwolf oh and do you believe there's a life after death, heaven and hell?

@chy I never 'chose' christianity, as such, I conformed. What made me leave was pure disbelief, a lack of the divine, hypocrisy and reality. Research wise, I've studied, I've read the old testament and the new testament. I've also studied Islam to some degree along with many other's and settled on what 'felt' right for me, what I connected with Spiritually. Not all Christians are bad people, not all Muslims are terrorists and not all Pagans are evil. Individual human interpretation of faith is a very personal thing, and in my opinion should not be a method of human control. Too often bad people hide behind their 'good guy badge' , how many killers find 'Jesus' to absolve their sins? Their are fundamentalists in every faith. I do not believe in heaven or hell, but I do believe in reincarnation. I believe in the immortality of the soul. I also believe in the archaeology of Mesopotamia, and have studied Sitchin's work: "The Lost Book of ENKI: Memoirs and Prophecies of an Extra Terrestrial God". That work, in my opinion, is the most realistic and probable of all creation stories, taken from Lapis Lazuli tablets that far predate Christianity. I think Christianity is a melting pot of all the old religions, changed and converted to serve the will of man and the nation of Israel.

@Weirdwolf thank you for taking the time to give such a detailed answer so early in the morning 💗 still don't understand why you 'conformed' as for the lack of divine I'm sorry, it may be possible that you could see/feel God through the hypocrisy?? It's true there is good and bad in every faith etc... But sadly some people do paint all with the tarred brush of a few 😔 there are some in church that aren't true but I wouldn't let anyone else's actions or hypocrisy alter my path if it's within my power. I think religion especially misused can be and has been used to control but in my opinion Christianity isn't about being religious it's a relationship.. Does the faith you've settled on have any rules or ask for anything from you? As for the bad people doing death bed confessions etc... Yeah I had a problem with that too... But I don't believe their sins are absolved ALL OUR sins will still be judged and I believe that God sees the truth in the heart not the lies the lips may speak. I think Christianity and various religions have been used to serve mans will but if true Christianity was like this then being a Christian would easy... I not 100% clued up on all the going ons of the USA government but I do know that they are pushing a bill or whatever it's called trying to make Israel give up a good % of its land and during hitlers reign lots of 'Christian' countries blocked Jews from escaping to them for safety, doesn't sound like they are being served too well 😳 thank you for answering my questions 😊💗

@chy meant to be couldn't! Annoying auto correct! 😒

@chy I'm enjoying this conversation, and I will reply when I'm done doing my 'chores' 😉

@Weirdwolf so am I 😊 no need to rush though, I have a mountain of ironing and other housework to do myself I could be for days 😞😞 lol

So am I 😊😊 no rush though I have lots of housework including a mountain of ironing, I could be lost for days...... 😞😞

Ok, the chores can wait...... My God's require only respect and recognition. The major floor, for me, with Christianity is the lack of communication. Prayer is one sided. In my faith the Gods communicate with those who take the time to learn how to. I also view much of Christian belief as stolen from the old gods, for example, if we take a look at the Egyptian pantheon of Gods we find the story of the resurrection foretold before the bible, before Christ, in Horus, almost identical to the biblical interpretation. Then also the Norse pantheon and Odin, who sacrificed himself to himself suspended on the tree Yggdrasil. From this comes the story of the crucifixion. Odin was the most popular god amongst the pagans before the concept of Christianity. Also, the Greek Pantheon, Zues, with undeniable similarities with the descriptive imagery of god. Add to that all Christian holidays are based on pagan festivals. Stolen, or should I say 'converted'. Another point that should be raised is that of 'the burning times', over one third of the population of Europe was put to death, horrifically in the name of god, this was the true holocaust. Forced acceptance of belief. Back then, as is written in the old testament, god was malevolent, a being to be feared. It was only when the new testament was written that the thought form god became a being of love and mercy. I also have to look at the diversity of divinity in the old faiths, all cultures, all civilisations had a pantheon of gods, these existed for thousands of years before Christ. It was the Roman empire, under Constantine who converted the world to Christianity, and do you know why? Because he saw a fireball in the sky. You and I as civilised human beings would know instantly that it was a meteorite and not a sign from 'god'. Mankind's ignorance to such things back then cemented the fate of the gods for the interpretation of one man, all be it the most powerful man on the planet, at the time. The roman empire was strong eno

@chy as for Israel, it's a stolen state. It belongs to the palestinians. The Jews who have the land where implanted during the crusades and are of European stock not middle eastern heritage. The true Israelites where black from Africa, possibly the remnants of the Egyptian dynasties that traveled up the mile to escape invasion as empires fell.

@Weirdwolf *Nile (stupid spell checker)

@merlin1038 My friend our opinions may differ but we both bleed red 😉

@smellyfingers the only thing that is certain in life is death. It's true, it's the one thing, regardless of opinion that we all share. I suppose each of us finds comfort an acceptance of the inevitable in our own way. I believe strongly that I have lived before, and that I will live again, forever, in one form or another by the transmigration of souls.

@Weirdwolf firstly WOW! Thank you for writing in such detail 😊 your Gods deserve only respect and recognition, I believe that's what God wants too to be any a loving relationship with us.. If you ran around slaughtering masses of people would your Gods not mind? Would they want some sort of repentance from you? The bible and my upbringing teaches me that laws and rules are important and they are there to guide me... If God wanted to force Christianity on any one he wouldn't have given us free will I believe that just as my mum gave me rules growing up outta love that the rules God suggests are outta love and to help me not confine me. As for the prayer part I will say its just the same in christianity. Prayer is hard for humans because of our expectations of how it should go. I'm sorry you felt you got not answers 😔 but for me he always answers and talks to me even if it's not always the answer I want! 😜 the bible tells be that me that Jesus was around before the world began and his resurrection was prophesied in the garden of Eden. Yes there have been some disgusting things done in the name of God, not just in Christianity it's sad but I believe that's sin not God causing that. I believe he has always had mercy but he is a father and we can be brats to deal with 😳😜 as for Israel I'm not clued up enough to get really into that but do you know the origins of the Palestinians? And can you attest 100% that they didn't take the land from someone before them? But like I said don't know enough about that 😁

@chy firstly I respect your opinion and belief system and I'm really enjoying these comments as communication and understanding is key IMO, not many will reveal their beliefs and talk about them openly. Ok, you say the bible and your upbringing teaches you rules and laws but who's writing these laws and rules?? IMO its human nature to want to belong and be told what to do and how to behave but again IMO history has shown and proven that Christianity and other religions use their books of faith to control, manipulate and put fear into others, sure it may be only a small section of "followers" that are corrupt but again IMO he corruption comes from the top or near the top and filters it's way down through the ranks, as it were. Example would be in the Ryan Report (Irish institutions where boys and girls were beaten, raped and tortured by those in the church, also proven cover ups a denial altho, the pope himself has apologised over the matter). As weirdwolf also mentioned alot of Christianity's "stories" and characters are taken from many other faiths and given a "make over" to suit that time period in history when there were lots of so called followers of Christianity who had various forms of a bible until Constantine re-wrote the bible with the help of top scholars and influential characters of his time, now called the new testament. I guess it all comes down to the individual what he/she believes in based on location they born/live I the world and the parents as to what faith/belief we have, some break away due to personal experiances others stay loyal and live happy lives. Let me ask you a question tho: do you think we are born Christian, muslim, Jewish, ect?

@Weirdwolf yep I agree! Death is the only guarantee, that and you have been born, what happens in-between is up to you, some fear it, others accept it, some also prepare for it through knowledge and other things. I too believe in afterlife and reincarnation and believe my soul has lived many times before in different forms. I believe I evolution altho I have alternative views to Darwins beginning of man on earth. I do believe we live each life in order to gain knowledge and learn lesson with the ultimate goal is to be as one with our own god(s) however they are defined/interpreted. IMO it takes many, many life times and only a handful of souls have reached that "level" (Jesus, Mohamed, Gandhi, mother Teresa type of souls). I like to think of it all like a game of snakes and ladders, in one life we may go up the ladder, another life we may go down the snake, some lasers are tall and some snakes are short. In order to be as one with a god we must experience the good with the bad, to be all knowing and all powerful (as a god) takes time.

@smellyfingers thank you for commenting I do love discussing and am open to hearing other people's views. I wasn't brought up in any church and my parents are from the Caribbean so if I go by the faith I SHOULD be I don't think it would be Christian.... I don't believe we are born set in stone to any religion I think it's all about our choices.. As for Constantine rewriting I'm not 100% sure of I do know that in has been translated and that there are some versions that have been changed and the there have been a lot of wrong that has been in Gods name but I guess that's what I believe is the difference between religion and a relationship with God.. I believe that the rules I follow we're were given by God... And my mum 😜💗 as for the human nature thing now I'm worried cause belonging in the crowd and being told what to do kinda freaks me out! Lol I can honestly say I've never felt forced or judged in my faith but that could be cause I've chosen to see God and not man... My christian life is far from perfect and so am I but I know I'm on a journey and O'm learning every day Hope I've made some sort of sense! 💗

@chy I'm glad you are open minded hun and my questions are not to confuse or question your belief/faith, I just curious and a nosey git, lol. Have you ever sen your god appear before you? Do you not think god/religion(s) is/are to some extent "man made?" IMO since man has existed we have always and always will ask: where did we come from and where are we going, and why? I would say they are and to me that would suggest that god(s) live inside us and are created by us, however we define it/them/he/she ect. I guess then we are all a reflection of our god(s). My problem (in the bigger scope of things) is are we as the human race making good progress or taking steps backwards?? IMO I don't think there is a right or wrong belief, whatever helps individuals in life, but are we evolving well or being conditioned as a race? And the human nature thing, look at tribal type people, they all have a role, a community, a system, rules, god(s) ect, I'm sure you'll be able to see similarities to "modern civilised man" lol. Take your role/purpose away and break up the community/society and what are you left with? Lol

@smellyfingers lol I don't think you're a nosey git and your not confusing me or making me doubt my faith 😊 I have never seen my God 'appear' before me I don't expect that from him to me that would be like thinking of him as a magician lol the way I see it is it's like the wind... I've never actually seen it but I see evidence of it, for me I can see and feel evidence of God every day in so many ways 😊 I believe I am Gods creation i don't believe I created God. My faith in God wasn't sought through questioning where I cam from or where I'm going as to be honest they weren't really on my mind... It came from something much deeper inside. As for the human race... I think think we are in a ridiculous state but I don't believe that's because of God I believe it's because of sin In Mankind... Lol get what you're saying about about human nature and I think we would all still have and need roles even without rules or faith and religion... the roles we have in our families etc.. I don't think it's so much that I myself need to be told what to do or need to belong but I am aware that the presence of rules laws etc gives me guidance that helps. Being a Christian for me and many others I know isn't about belonging to a mass group of people following blindly without thought its about a personal journey and relationship with God. The rules and the mass are there for guidance, support and fellowship. 😊

@Weirdwolf You have written so much truth in this, about the past and the perversions of the truth. I went through various stages, belief, non belief and have ended up with a truth that sits comfortably with me. History can teach us so much if we are prepared to have an open mind but the problem is we are taught not to question. I respect people with faith, my closest friends are Christian and I respect that but I need to find my own truth. It drives me mad when I see the same people castigated over and over for bad acts they have committed whilst others, who have better p r are treated as saints! I have been lucky to have had free thinking friends, all good people, who have taught me about ancient truths. Like @smellyfingers I am certain we live many lives and hopefully get a bit wiser each time! 🐑

@smellyfingers I agree with the bit about human race evolving and agree with bits @chy states and also WW (I'm a cop out 😉). A religion pre dating another can't give the first a claim to more truth. Man, from the moment he has had cognitive thought has created deities. As his knowledge increases the complexity of his religion has also. It could be argued that like a parent teaching a child, the older we get the more truth can be imparted. Bottom line is nobody will know until their time is up 😉 but inner peace is an achievable goal with godlike qualities. May you god be with you 😉👍

@smellyfingers @chy again from first man, religion has been used to create power and a banner to kill under regardless what the god is called... If there was no religion man would find another banner to do the same 😒

@Burrfoot yeah I know 😞 a tyrant will always find a reason for tyranny... And mankind will do what it wants regardless...

@crowncottage You hit nail on the head with: "taught not to question". This is something I agree with wholeheartedly. Many people will adopt their parents faith, and never question it. My own faith teaches me to question "Everything". For me, this works well, for life is a pursuit of knowledge. Agai

@crowncottage Again you hit the mail on the head with Good/Bad pr. History is written by winners, to the victor the spoils. Regardless of how that victory is gained. The Old God's became devils and demons in the eyes of the masses through fear and indoctrination. We are taught as humans that we have "Choice", but this is a very modern thing, and an ancient thing. But for centuries freedom of thought and choice lay solely in the hands of the church. You either renounced the past and accepted Christianity or where put to death. Had this method not be viciously enforced I do not believe Christianity would exist today.

@chy I wonder, this 'relationship' you have with your god, how do you know it's god? Could it be a different entity, a different force that you have labeled as good through what you have been taught, in the absence of an alternative? I understand exactly what you mean when you describe your experiences, but have you ever developed this relationship through other methods not used in the Christian faith? For example, divination, by whatever method? My gods communicate in many ways, one needs only to learn how to, and they are there.

@Burrfoot @chy Yes, unfortunately man will dictate the will of god to his/her own gain. We only need to look at the crusades, the struggle between Christianity and Islam, or closer to home even than that, protestants against Catholics. All worship the same god, but would happily kill each other to enforce their own particular "brand". There will always be tyrants, the world is full of them. Absolute power corrupts Absolutely.

@Weirdwolf I am agreeing again. I think the expression might is right fits here. I think in it's purest form, religion is good for people but the problem is that it gets perverted by selfishness. One of my favourite expressions is that man is progressing backwards and I think in spiritual matters that's true. I have discussed all of this many times over the years, my circle of friends were all fascinated by the subject too and lived their lives accordingly. I think the hardest thing to swallow is when evil is excused because it's executed in the name of God, any God would not sanction that.

Sorry but I lost track of what I was writing because the tv is on with Tom Daley diving, please forgive me! 😹

@crowncottage no problem!! My dad cut our nightly phone call short for the very same reason!! 😂

@Weirdwolf I actually started the relationship with God before going to church my faith led me to the church and bible part. I had heard about Christianity and was taught other religions in school. I started talking and seeking him myself and he showed me so much and still is. I believe 100% he is God

@crowncottage evil is not excused I believe everyone will be judged for their lives..

@chy I also believe we are judged for our lives but I think we judge ourselves when we look back at what we have done. We have to face the fact that we have given pain and we can't keep any secrets from ourselves. Don't think that I don't believe in God, I do but I don't believe in anyone telling me how to believe it.

@chy @Weirdwolf hey guys just wanted to thank you for this discussion. It is truly fascinating. I won't be changing my faith though as I truly believe my God did save me and bring peace into my life. It was a very real conversion from a life where I had no discernible faith. I don't have the intellect to argue my faith as you guys but I know it is real and I know my lord is leading me to serve which I believe we should all feel we can do regardless of faith and if for nothing more than the benefit of humanity itself. 😉

@merlin1038 Faith, Will and Intention are remarkable tools my friend, and we serve Our God's well with the gifts we have. Many people have no Faith at all. No Will to believe and undesirable intentions. We are the lucky ones Brother.

@chy heee heee auto correct lol sorry that tickled me.

@Weirdwolf it's all smoke and mirrors amigo we are all gods with vast power to do what's right or what's wrong or maintain balance. The big question is our intentions -collectively. I'm not sure if I enjoyed your written piece more than this whole (very amicable) debate. Isn't it an absolute refreshing pleasure to converse with such enlightened and noble souls 😉🙏 A soul of your magnitude is surely to have unlocked the keys to ones purpose.